The b/g, The professional, and the Curse.

[Flyingdjdan]

Fred Stewart posted this in another thread, and got me curious...

But when more people see professional DJ company entertainment as unnecessary, something has to change. DJs have to eat, same as everyone else.

I sometimes wonder. Are they truly at a point where they find professional entertainment unnecessary?

Or

Could it be that there is really a lot less of professional and original entertainment available to them?

(p.s. THIS IS NOT ABOUT F/T OR P/T!) Yes, I yelled that! This also is not directed specifically to anyone, just food for everyone to think about.

Even if you say you there are plenty of quality out there... How can a typical b/g tell the difference between professional and copycat and amature. Most b/g do research on the web and are easily lied to. We know it! It is easy!

Look around in your area. Do a search. Try to read from a "I don't know" perspective.

In reading our websites and marketing materials, just how easy is it for a "non experienced, non educated" b/g to decipher the differences between a quality entertainer and a wanna be?

A novice dj can spend a day cutting and pasting "phrases" from a thousand websites and have a darn good one website put together in no time. Hosting is cheap, and there are tons of "do it yourself" programs let alone tons of quality templates.

Pics? Easily attainable for a few bucks each.

References. A good imagination can solve that. A few creative "theeerrrreeee grrrreeeeaaaattttt" comments, couple friends cell phones. Tell em you'll pay em a 6 pack for every call they handle and say how great you are. How many brides truly will follow up and call the refrences anway?

Ok, so meeting skills can't be faked. But key questions and answers are all over the place. Chat boards are great foddor for "talking points" and "catch phrases".

Planners: We all share em. Posted all over chat boards.

Contracts: Same. Posted all over.

Equipment: Cheap as hell. Dude Walker and I talked the other day. Hell, one can buy a "cheap but effective" setup off of ebay for less than a lot of us charge for a base rate to perform. We already know "uncle bill" and the ipod are contemplated by a lot of b/g's out there. An effective system is just as easy to attain. Some of the "cheap" stuff today is better than the "high end" equipment a lot of us started out with years ago!

Music Do I really need to say??

It boils down to the show, and by this time it is too late. The b/g got lucky, or not. If bad, you got 100 or more people thinking dj's suck. Then all dj's get lumped into the ball. We suck. We are not origional. We won't do what the b/g want. We won't play their requests. We....

Face it... "Professional dj" really don't mean sh**. Hell, WE can't even begin to agree on what a professional dj is. How the heck is a b/g supposed to know???

I honestly think the internet is our biggest asset, and biggest curse.

I am not looking for "what to do" ideas. I have my own, hopefully you do to. Just looking for thoughts on this in general.

 

[SoftJock Rick]

Tell em you'll pay em a 6 pack for every call they handle and say how great you are.

I'm available, and have a phone



I think a lot of DJ's promotion is done poorly (wait, don't hit me that hard).

Couple things I would do, if still DJ'ing:

1) Website/brochure would clearly have a front and center good picture of me, the DJ.

Whether tis right or wrong, many people will hire, or not hire, based upon looks. It could be they are looking for a particular style of DJ/MC, it could be racial based, gender based, or any other number of reasons.

Looks are a large part of our society, whether we like it or not.

2) There would be a video/dvd available, with a number of different types of events represented.

There's no reason why every DJ shouldn't have one in this day and age. This would alleviate almost all issues regarding potential clients wanting to see you in action, and again, the looks factor of you and your equipment will be plainly visible.


I sincerely think those two things, will get you more business than you can handle, if done properly. There's no need to educate any client, as they can see exactly who you are, what you are, and how you work.

Just my .0002

 

[Guest]

Rick nailed it on the DVD.

I shoot videos and pictures at just about every event I do. I have put together several demo DVDs and will show them at the interview. The client gets to see me in action.

I had one client (yes, I said client) ask me how old I was on the phone. I told her that should make no difference. Shew granted the interview.

After she booked she said that she was a little aprehensive when this fat, balding, 48-year-old showed up for the interview. She then said that the demo DVD sealed the deal. She ended up buying the full package and we rocked the house for her and her guests.

As to when they find "professional" entertainment unnecessary, it really depends on many factors. For example, would you hire a DJ for a very small gathering (25 or less)? Suppose that gathering was at your house?

I actually had one client (and I said it again) want to hire the full DJ package for an intimate gathering of 20 people. What I suggested instead was an enhancement of our iPod support package. He talked his friends into bringing along their iPods and I had one of my assisstants available to help them swap out iPods. The party was originally for two hours and ended up going six. The client was happy, the guests were happy, and my assisstant was happy (OT plus a big tip).

I don't call that professiuonal entertainment. It is more like professional audio support.

 

[Fred Wright]

Well, definining "professional" in this crazy biz may be subjective to say the least. But we do what we can.

Paying a DJ service may be an unnecessary expense for many B&Gs who cannot afford it. We're not alone. If you can't afford a photographer or videographer, high-toned catered dinner, a bartender, rented venue etc, well you can't afford 'em.

That said, the DVD option is a nice touch. We've been doing this at weddings for a couple years now. Amongst her many gadgets, Shirl has one of those newfangled video cams that burns directly to a mini DVD. She's got the software on her machine to manage it all, too. We send the B&G a copy once it's done.

Later, we'll sit and watch it and critique our performance.

 

[DJ Gray]

I think I have posted on this or very similar topics many times......Selling, presentation.

So many of the Wedding DJ's today, do business over the phone or the Internet. I hope you realize that every time a B & G is disappointed/Upset with their DJ's performance, that we all suffer...........

Where is it written, that as a performer/vendor we don't have the right/obligation, to meet with our clients, face to face before we commit?

It (the success or failure of a Dj or the business as a whole), has never had anything to do with price or F/t, P/T. It has to do with presenting ourselves as professionals, and I'm sorry but that can't be done over the phone, or by E-Mail.

When some of these B&G's see the type of job they get, it's no wonder they look to I-Pods.

The Solution........is very easy, but requires some additional time......insist on a face to face meeting before any commitments have been made by either party. Let the client know that you are concerned about how you (the DJ) come across, it's your reputation that's at stake also, and referrals are the backbone of your business. You don't want to take something on that you are not comfortable with, no different than how they feel......

If more DJ's insisted on this type of approach, and truly considered themselves Professionals, We would not be seeing this current attitude on the part of B's & G's towards DJ's.....

Gray Out....

 

[Flyingdjdan]

It is nice (comforting) to see that I am thinking the same as many others, and am contemplating, or doing, many other things formentioned.

Thanks for your insight!

While others have been doing phone and internet planning successfully, I strongly agree that a face to face is necessary. Not only for them, but mostly for you, as a dj. I won't take a job I can't, or don't think I can handle. But gladly tell the client I will help them find someone who fits their needs better. Better to have lost a job, then screw it up.

Getting a dvd is big on my list of things to get done. Big!

This is definetly the age of seeing is believing. As mentioned by GoodKnight, my age is getting to be a possible point of contention. Showing I can still hang with you yungunz ( I hope ) will be helpful!

Thanks for the thoughts so far.

 

[Guest]

The Solution........is very easy, but requires some additional time......insist on a face to face meeting before any commitments have been made by either party. Let the client know that you are concerned about how you (the DJ) come across, it's your reputation that's at stake also, and referrals are the backbone of your business. You don't want to take something on that you are not comfortable with, no different than how they feel......

If more DJ's insisted on this type of approach, and truly considered themselves Professionals, We would not be seeing this current attitude on the part of B's & G's towards DJ's.....

Again , the voice of experience prevails.

I get the clients that want a quote over the phone or in an e-mail just like so many of you do as well. I tell them that we would rather meet with them and show them some of our work and then give them the quote.

Some will still push back on this until we further explain that it is not only an interview to decide if they want us as their mobile entertainer but it is also an interview of them to determine if we are a proper fit for them. One lady said, "Just give me the GD quote!" I told her that I did not think we were the mobile entertainment company for her, thanked her for her interest, said goodbye, and hung up.

Originally I was only doing interviews for weddings and Motzvahs. Now I try to get one for all event types.

 

[DJ Gray]

I hope that my comments are seen as "constructive", I realize we are in the "new" information age of the "Internet". Just because we have entered this fast moving, "impersonal" communication realm, doesn't mean we have to go "brain dead" on basic "interpersonal" skills.

I have had more comments from clients saying they appreciate the concern for their wants/desires, that I express, for their event. I explain that I need to chat to find out the "What, Where's Who's and Why's" before I have a comfort level for what I will be doing for them. I inform them that for me, the only way I know what they want is to meet with them, to get to know them, to interact.

Unfortunately in todays "selling" community, this approach is in the minority. The "Wam Bam" thank you "Mam" approach is far more popular with the younger set.

Sales people in all lines of work have choosen to "impersonalize" the sales approach, and opt for the quick, impersonal close.

In my 35 year career in sales I didn't have 500 clients, I had 500 new friends..............

 

[Fred Wright]

Another thing to consider is pro photographers. These folks rarely if ever simply quote a price when asked.

The way it's done, they meet with prospective clients and show examples of their best work. With the right puter utilities, even the poorest of lighting conditions and other SNAFUs can be fixed up. So you have a brochure of professional photos to back your cost to the client.

Successful selling of something as intangible and subjective as mobile entertainment will be much easier when you have something tangible to demonstrate to the prospect.

 

[DJ Gray]

Another thing to consider is pro photographers. These folks rarely if ever simply quote a price when asked.

The way it's done, they meet with prospective clients and show examples of their best work. With the right puter utilities, even the poorest of lighting conditions and other SNAFUs can be fixed up. So you have a brochure of professional photos to back your cost to the client.

Successful selling of something as intangible and subjective as mobile entertainment will be much easier when you have something tangible to demonstrate to the prospect.

As Fred has said "...they meet with prospective....."

As an Industry we are to quick to take the "Lazy" way out. No "Face to Face" until you meet after both parties have committed to contract.....a little late at this time.

Until this "wham bam thank you mam" approach changes, DJ's will always be at the bottom of B & G's list...........

 

[Jeff Romard]

I am trying to make a difference in my market. Trying to push the bar to make the others in the market reach it. I offer a contract (which no one else here does) I try to keep a reasonably clean setup (few and far between here) I use professional business equipment and know how to use it properly (again hit and miss here)

Another thing I do is offer meetings and planning sessions to perspective clients. Only one in ten take me up on the offer. Most email me or phone me in a list of wants and don't wants and thats the contact I have until the day of the event

Although I prefer to have the time with the client before the event I have had many successful events without any or very little personal contact

I used to think it might be because I do alot of referrals so the trust is there but this year I've noticed that alot of cold callers are following this trend also

 

[Flyingdjdan]

I am trying to make a difference in my market. Trying to push the bar to make the others in the market reach it. I offer a contract (which no one else here does) I try to keep a reasonably clean setup (few and far between here) I use professional business equipment and know how to use it properly (again hit and miss here)

Another thing I do is offer meetings and planning sessions to perspective clients. Only one in ten take me up on the offer. Most email me or phone me in a list of wants and don't wants and thats the contact I have until the day of the event

Although I prefer to have the time with the client before the event I have had many successful events without any or very little personal contact

I used to think it might be because I do alot of referrals so the trust is there but this year I've noticed that alot of cold callers are following this trend also

That's what I am talking about!!!!

Taking pride in what you do and who you are. Realizing the importance! Taking these measures increases your value, and sets you apart.

Doing these, even seemingly trivial things such as hiding cords, shows you care, are bettering yourself, and will add value to you!

Standing ovation sir!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[DJ Gray]

I am trying to make a difference in my market. Trying to push the bar to make the others in the market reach it. I offer a contract (which no one else here does) I try to keep a reasonably clean setup (few and far between here) I use professional business equipment and know how to use it properly (again hit and miss here)

Another thing I do is offer meetings and planning sessions to perspective clients. Only one in ten take me up on the offer. Most email me or phone me in a list of wants and don't wants and thats the contact I have until the day of the event

Although I prefer to have the time with the client before the event I have had many successful events without any or very little personal contact

I used to think it might be because I do alot of referrals so the trust is there but this year I've noticed that alot of cold callers are following this trend also

I think that says it all......think about this for a minute.........

This movement towards more impersonal involvement by the younger/current wedding generation, says volumes about marriage today......hear me out.......

My/Your wedding day was the most important personal day of my life, at that time of my life....anyone else feel that way??.....

We spent more time meeting people, discussing our wants, and things unwanted.......this was our special day....some 42 years ago..........A Very Personal Day

Today it's no surprise divorce rates are where they are at 50% Marriage is not what it use to be.......Todays couples do not have a problem doing business this impersonal way......so does that mean you don't have to act as a professional, just because you don't have to..... to get the business??

If more of us would be more insistent on (face to face) meetings before any commitments have been made, maybe some of these non-professional DJ's will be out of work, and the overall reputation for the "Professional DJ" will begin to rise.....

 

[Jeff Romard]

Today it's no surprise divorce rates are where they are at 50% Marriage is not what it use to be.......Todays couples do not have a problem doing business this impersonal way......so does that mean you don't have to act as a professional, just because you don't have to..... to get the business??

If more of us would be more insistent on (face to face) meetings before any commitments have been made, maybe some of these non-professional DJ's will be out of work, and the overall reputation for the "Professional DJ" will begin to rise.....

Or mabye the better ones will be. Isn't it all about what the client wants? I dealt with a client yesterday that signed the contract, passed me the deposit and a list of 3 songs, and told me basically don't contact them until the day of the wedding. If I had insisted on meetings before the event she would have walked away...Very unsatisfied

We all preach about it being thier day and thier way so why would you want to force them in to meetings and planning sessions they don't want to be a part of. People hire me because they trust me. They trust my experience and knowledge of thier type of event. I do everything I can from hello to goodnight to build and maintain that trust. Mabye thats why only one in ten take me up on the offer

 

[Proformance]

Even if you say you there are plenty of quality out there... How can a typical b/g tell the difference between professional and copycat and amature. Most b/g do research on the web and are easily lied to. We know it! It is easy!

Look around in your area. Do a search. Try to read from a "I don't know" perspective.

In reading our websites and marketing materials, just how easy is it for a "non experienced, non educated" b/g to decipher the differences between a quality entertainer and a wanna be?

You assume that the only thing a prospect can do to evaluate a DJ is read marketing material. That is the furthest thing from reality.

Sales are not made by marketing materials. Marketing is just one way you can get found. The sale is made by other means.

Sales are made through personal exchange when people talk, meet, exchange ideas, refer, reference, interview, or otherwise evaluate the credibility of someone they have stopped to consider.

The only important line in your marketing material is the phone number.

 

[Flyingdjdan]

Or mabye the better ones will be. Isn't it all about what the client wants? I dealt with a client yesterday that signed the contract, passed me the deposit and a list of 3 songs, and told me basically don't contact them until the day of the wedding. If I had insisted on meetings before the event she would have walked away...Very unsatisfied

We all preach about it being thier day and thier way so why would you want to force them in to meetings and planning sessions they don't want to be a part of. People hire me because they trust me. They trust my experience and knowledge of thier type of event. I do everything I can from hello to goodnight to build and maintain that trust. Mabye thats why only one in ten take me up on the offer

This is just me, but I honestly would not have wanted to perform at this wedding. Knowing nothing of the client, guests, music liked, etc. is a recipe for disaster in the making.

You decided to accept. More power to you.

Performance wrote:

You assume that the only thing a prospect can do to evaluate a DJ is read marketing material. That is the furthest thing from reality.

Sales are not made by marketing materials. Marketing is just one way you can get found. The sale is made by other means.

Sales are made through personal exchange when people talk, meet, exchange ideas, refer, reference, interview, or otherwise evaluate the credibility of someone they have stopped to consider.

The only important line in your marketing material is the phone number.

Maybe, or more likely obviously, my initial intent wasn't clear.

Initial contact is what I am addressing. Getting to the phone call, meeting or other methods of operation.

Once the initial contact has been made, all the above and individual value, strengths can be sold.

Getting to this point, the first contact. We are all sounding the same.

 

[Jeff Romard]

This is just me, but I honestly would not have wanted to perform at this wedding. Knowing nothing of the client, guests, music liked, etc. is a recipe for disaster in the making.

You decided to accept. More power to you.

I think you are missing the point.... She's not fussy. She wants music and someone that can read the crowd and keep her guests happy. I guess it could be said she want's a cookie cutter wedding. She wants the same thing her friends had. Why? Mabye she seen what she liked there

If it's cookie cutter she wants it's cookie cutter she gets...She's the client, I am the DJ, she hired me to do a job not streach my ego and tell her what she wants/needs

Last night I arrived at my event early as always. The B&G arrive about an hour later and after I announce them in the groom comes up and asks me to MC the dinner because the MC they had didn't show up. Now this event was planned out I had quite a few phone conversations and 2 meetings face to face with them. This was never part of the plan.

I stepped in did all the announcements, told a few jokes to let the guests become more comfortable,released the tables, announced the head table etc. After the dinner was over a friend of the bride asked how long I have known them. I told her about 3 weeks(they were late bookers). Her Jaw dropped. She thought I must have known them and the families a long time from the way I interacted with them. I'll be mailing her out a contract for her daughters wedding today

The point is if you are good at what you do you shouldn't need hours of planning to do what you do every weekend.

 

[Flyingdjdan]

Jeff,

I am not going to argue the above post. A good dj can get basic info on a client, and make an event fun, entertaining, and successful.

IMO, the more time spent with a client, getting to know them, the more personalized the event can become. The more unique, and representative of their individual styles. Thus a different feel, if even slightly, that will make each event unique.

You may have a talent into really reading a person's personality quickly. Not many do. Cap has a very successful business and hardly ever meets with the bride and groom. I couldn't do that either. Neither is wrong and no dj has "the perfect method" of success for every event.

I feel the more time spent with a client, the less the possibility for screw ups and improves the chances for stellar events.

A lot truly depends on the clients expectations. What have they seen done? What do they think can be done? What you have promised, and what you deliver.

Do you not have different expectations from a band at the local "bar" to be different than a band at the auditorium, or a stadium?

Each can be told they are great! Depending on the individuals expectations walking in the door, "great" can truly mean many different things.

 

[DJ Gray]

Or mabye the better ones will be. Isn't it all about what the client wants? I dealt with a client yesterday that signed the contract, passed me the deposit and a list of 3 songs, and told me basically don't contact them until the day of the wedding. If I had insisted on meetings before the event she would have walked away...Very unsatisfied

We all preach about it being thier day and thier way so why would you want to force them in to meetings and planning sessions they don't want to be a part of. People hire me because they trust me. They trust my experience and knowledge of thier type of event. I do everything I can from hello to goodnight to build and maintain that trust. Mabye thats why only one in ten take me up on the offer

If you would have read into my post you would have seen that it's not just for them you are doing the..*&^??... I guess?? ...dreaded..."Face to Face" meeting. What does it say about the concern, the importance of what we do as DJ's when they (B's & G's) don't even need to meet us, before committing to the event, the most important day of their life????

And some wonder why we as DJ's we are on the bottom of the totem "pole" when it comes to wedding vendors????

Like it or not this Industry needs an "image enhancement"......

I think more of my abilities as a DJ and I chose not to do weddings.....

Unfortunately it's the bad Wedding DJ,m that has framed the publics increasing negative opinion of all DJ's........

I venture to say in the aggregate, DJ's doing weddings over the next 5 Years, will be down 50%.......I hope this does not come to pass, but the early signs are already there...........

In my area you can get numerous good bands for under $700, several very good bands for $400-$500..????

 

[Jeff Romard]

Jeff,

IMO, the more time spent with a client, getting to know them, the more personalized the event can become. The more unique, and representative of their individual styles. Thus a different feel, if even slightly, that will make each event unique.

Dan I agree 100%

alot truly depends on the clients expectations. What have they seen done? What do they think can be done? What you have promised, and what you deliver.

Along with what you have the ability to deliver again I agree