Help Me To Understand This.

[ahoustondj]

I am in the process of buying some Professional Wedding Photography and other images which contain people. The Photographer may claim to "own" the copyrights to these pictures, however, should he first have a Model's Release from everyone in the picture?
So lets say a Bride & Groom hires this Photographer and he comes and takes posed as well as candid shots at the reception, how can he claim to "own" these images? What if I purchase these images from him and someone in the photos sees it online and decides to sue me for using their photo without them giving me permission?
How does this all shakedown? Unless the Photographer was also paying me a fee every time he sold an image in which I was included, I would not want to freely give him permission. Do people who if they sign a release knowingly do this? Whats more important, the Photo, Photographer or the Models in the image? Without the models there would be no photos.
I have never had to deal with this situation. In my other business I have represented Photographers and their works but it has always been images of Cityscapes, Buildings etc.
What say you?

 

[TheOlogee]

I say call an attorney.

 

[steve149]

I would ask to see the model releases for anyone appearing in a photo if they can be readily identified (ie. not a large crowd shot). The contract the photographer had with their clients may allow reproduction and sale and may not.

 

[SoftJock Rick]

I'm not sure of the exact details -- but pretty much, if you take the shot, you own it.

It's like this post -- I own it for all intents and purposes. Someone could challenge that in court, but I doubt they would win, since I wrote it.

I almost always use images from my own wedding, because nobody will fight me on it.

Bottom line: Take the pics yourself, or be in the pic.

 

[ahoustondj]

I'm not sure of the exact details -- but pretty much, if you take the shot, you own it.

It's like this post -- I own it for all intents and purposes. Someone could challenge that in court, but I doubt they would win, since I wrote it.

I almost always use images from my own wedding, because nobody will fight me on it.

Bottom line: Take the pics yourself, or be in the pic.

Taking the pics yourself does not automatically give one the right to publish them without expressed permission of those who appear in the photos. To me that is the biggest issue. I think the only exception is if it was at a public event.

 

[SoftJock Rick]

Taking the pics yourself does not automatically give one the right to publish them without expressed permission of those who appear in the photos. To me that is the biggest issue. I think the only exception is if it was at a public event.

So why did you ask the question, if you seemingly know the answer...?


Technically, I could sue you for quoting my post -- what are the odds though...?

 

[ahoustondj]

So why did you ask the question, if you seemingly know the answer...?


Technically, I could sue you for quoting my post -- what are the odds though...?

I never said that is the answer Rick. It is simply a discussion. I see people on here posting posed pics and videos and was wondering if they had gotten permission of those in the shots!

 

[steve149]

You may be allowed to "take" the shot, but you aren't automatically given the right to use it for promotional or money making purposes, thus the need for a release. Even if taken in the public domain, an individual can still claim ownership of "their" image if you try to use it to gain profit without their consent.

Posting it here, is a bit different than posting it on your website.

 

[SoftJock Rick]

You may be allowed to "take" the shot, but you aren't automatically given the right to use it for promotional or money making purposes, thus the need for a release. Even if taken in the public domain, an individual can still claim ownership of "their" image if you try to use it to gain profit without their consent.

Posting it here, is a bit different than posting it on your website.

Grey area Steve -- it's up to the courts in individual cases...

For example, let's say I walk out to the pool, and someone like Chucky takes my pic, because I'm standing next to some hot chick in a bikini, and he posts it. I could sue him for that, unless he asked me.

On the other hand, let's say me and the chick asked him to take the pic... Whole different story.


Did ya ever wonder why I don't take pics at the pool and post them here? It's because there is a "potential" for getting my sorry ass sued (and ass kicked by their boyfriends/husbands). Discretion is the key, although the grey area comes in when you are in a public place.

Bob will argue this I'm sure, but IMHO, once I walk out my door, I'm in a public place...

 

[Ausumm]

I am not a lawyer (nor do I play one on TV)...
But if someone POSES for a picture, isn't that "permission"?
If they have any concerns about what will happen to the picture, they should not agree to it.
Random shots of a crowd at a private function may mean different rules.

 

[SoftJock Rick]

Random shots of a crowd at a private function may mean different rules.

There's the grey area Mike...

How do you define a "private function"...?

If yer in your bedroom, you should be able to expect privacy. If I take the dog out for a walk, should I expect privacy? If someone wants to take my pic, they can do it. They do not need a release.

If they decide to post it, becomes more of a moral issue...

Heck, go to TMZ, and see the crap they post -- and they get away with it.

 

[Ausumm]

The only people at a private function are guests who were INVITED.
So, you should expect the courtesy of being asked about taking and posting pics.
If you are out in public (walking the dog) you cannot expect privacy.
My point was, if take a picture of Times Square, and post it on the web...
you cannot be expected to get a signed waiver from everyone on the street at that moment.

 

[SoftJock Rick]

The only people at a private function are guests who were INVITED.
So, you should expect the courtesy of being asked about taking and posting pics.

There's the grey area...

What's a private function? It has to be determined on a case by case basis. Does the server filling the salad bar constitute a public event? Was he invited?

We used to have a Ramada Inn up the road, I used to go there and hang at the bar and watch the band. Sometimes, I would stroll into a room where a wedding reception was taking place. Since I was not invited, that now makes it a public event. Door was open, I walked in.

So, I was in public, and I cannot expect privacy. Neither can any of the other folks in there at that point.

 

[steve149]

The real issue is the intent of the photo. Taking it for yourself, ok. Taking it and posting it on a board like this, probably ok, assuming the picture was taken in a public location or the folks being photographed knew about it. The problem area is when you use that photo to sell, advertise, market or somehow promote a business. Then you are in an area that generally requires a release.

 

[DjDennis]

if you buy from a image website
all that should be covered and once you buy it then you can use it to what you like!

read the fine print first!

 

[Scott Hanna]

How important are these pictures? How much are you paying for the pictures? What are they being used for?

I would THINK...but not know, that if you purchased a picture that someone later wanted to sue because their image was used, that they would sue the person selling it, not the person buying it. Odds are the worst that would happen is you would need to stop using it for promotional purposes.

I would not pay a lawyer to hear his interpretation of this, and you'll get 5 different opinions from 5 different lawyers.

 

[Proformance]

I am in the process of buying some Professional Wedding Photography and other images which contain people. The Photographer may claim to "own" the copyrights to these pictures, however, should he first have a Model's Release from everyone in the picture?
So lets say a Bride & Groom hires this Photographer and he comes and takes posed as well as candid shots at the reception, how can he claim to "own" these images? What if I purchase these images from him and someone in the photos sees it online and decides to sue me for using their photo without them giving me permission?
How does this all shakedown? Unless the Photographer was also paying me a fee every time he sold an image in which I was included, I would not want to freely give him permission. Do people who if they sign a release knowingly do this? Whats more important, the Photo, Photographer or the Models in the image? Without the models there would be no photos.
I have never had to deal with this situation. In my other business I have represented Photographers and their works but it has always been images of Cityscapes, Buildings etc.
What say you?

The photogrpaher owns the image - meaning the composition itself and any rights to reproduce it.
The models either retain or release their rights to certain or all uses of their image/likeness.

For example, you may pose for a magazine cover, and release ONLY the right for your image to be used on the one magazine issue. Should the photographer who owns the shot (composition) later sell this photo to someone else - they would again need to obtain a release from you before publishing the image or using it somehow.

Most stock photos are created with the model being paid for the shoot and releasing all future claims. What you want when you buy such an image is a written copy of the license granting you the right to use the image, along with releases from any models. If you are buying them from an image broker you may not get the actual releases - but, you must insist that your license includes a contractual warranty indemnifying you against any such claims.

 

[jokerswild]

Bottom line: Take the pics yourself, or be in the pic.

I take all my own photo's that are on my website.... and it's pretty obvious I'm not a professional phtographer.

The question, though is: Will using photo's that a professional has taken from events or posed shots be beneficial to your business? In other words with the ROI be worth useing them?

 

[DjDennis]

Go to the sites that sell pics for you

weddings and djs etc

www.istockphoto.com

www.bigstockphoto.com

www.fotolia.com

Top Stock Photo Sites - Digital Cameras - About.com
10 Best Free Stock Photo Sites

just google them!





oh yeah read the DMCA Notice to understand

DMCA Notice | Stock Photos & Vector Art | Bigstock


Standard Image Usage Agreement

Image Usage Agreement | Stock Photos & Vector Art | Bigstock

read this to work out before buying photos
its on all these sites

PERMITTED WEB / ELECTRONIC USES
5. This Agreement grants you the right to:

a. Incorporate Images on web sites, provided that no Image is: i) displayed at a resolution greater than 1200 x 800 pixels; or ii) displayed as part of gallery, collection, album, archive, scrapbook or other aggregation of individual images, or
b. Use Images in coordination with opt-in email marketing. However, Images cannot be used in connection with unsolicited email or linked to from unsolicited email;
c. Incorporate Images into software as background images or splash screens, including but not limited to video games, phone applications and device firmware, provided that the Images or any digital files containing the Images cannot be unincorporated from the software;
d. Use Images in multimedia presentations and incorporate them into film and video;
e. Use Images in eBooks, including multi seat license electronic textbooks.
​

​

 

[steve149]

I take all my own photo's that are on my website.... and it's pretty obvious I'm not a professional phtographer.

The question, though is: Will using photo's that a professional has taken from events or posed shots be beneficial to your business? In other words with the ROI be worth useing them?

You have some of the issues even taking your own photos, in that you need releases (or should get them) of anyone discernible in the picture whenever you use a photo in marketing of your business. So if Suzie Bride is pictured, make sure your contract gives you the right to use photos in such a manner.

Not sure how we would get the others covered, as they most likely did not give a blanket release to the B/G ... that may be a question to ponder.