Pricing revisited

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On another thread I said that I had no problems discussing pricing but suggested that it be done in a separate thread. Well, this is that thread.

I'll start with my thoughts on the matter.

While I have had some go arounds with Ron Auger in the ppast on the full time vs. part time thing, he is right in regard to pricing differences. Part Timers have that other income source which can give them flexibility in pricing and Full Timers have to depend on what they get for their livlyhood. My philosophy was to always try to have a competitive price with the Full Timers because I didn't really want to put them out of business and I could justify that price with a time commitment to the clients.

In regard to putting prices on the web, I have done it both ways in the past. When I put the prices on the web I always included the caveat that these were starting prices and additional services or other factors may increase the price. I also noticed that when the prices were listed the inquiries dropped. When I went back to not listing the prices the inquiries went back up.

I also found that when I had the opportunity to interview with the prospect my chances of landing the event was higher. I attribute this to the presentation of the time commitment because mist folks really don't know about the time a DJ puts in on the front end and back end of their event. If presented properly their budget doesn't matter because they see the value and can find a way to afford it.

My pricing for weddings was 20 hours of time commitment @ $50.00/hour for a base of $1,000. With add-ons that could get up to $1,500. Parties required half the time commitment and started at $500. Mitzvahs were a higher time commitment of 30 hours and based at $1,500. Any travel time over one hour was priced out at $50/hour roundtrip; most travel was within an hour and travel pricing was based on Google Maps time from my home. Since a site visit was required for every venue, travel and time was factored in for that.

I considered the interview part of the cost of doing business.
 
Tom,
There is no go around. You charge what you think you're worth. I charge what I'm worth compared to other DJ's in my area. Part time/full time doesn't matter to the client. A part timer much like yourself can't put me out of business on price unless the quality of the work if above mine. And that doesn't happen much. So you are assuming the full timer is at the same level as you. For most people is comes down to what talent they wish to have and how much they are willing to pay for it. Extras are just that, extra, and play little role in the decision for the couples.

What I think you forgot to add about posting prices on your website was that you also state that your prices are negotiable. That's an open invitation for the clients to hire based on pricing for the most part. Your over all worth is diminished when you tell them right up front "if you ask you can get me cheaper". Which is understandable when getting what you can for money is most important. Of course there are always different circumstances as not every client is the same. And as always, this is just my opinion.
 
It's not the clients fault or concern whether we are part or full time. They don't care what the cost of running our business is. They don't care that it takes some of us more time to put together the same program as the other. The only thing they care about is getting a reasonable price and quality service.

So, as I've said many times and in many ways...

If you're truly being reasonable in your pricing, then it doesn't matter what it is. If you're making your clients compensate for your down time, ego or the the fact that you consider yourself a "Designer DJ", then good luck with that.

The bottom line is that we and or clients walk hand in hand. The question is who's hand do you want to take?
 
Ron Auger said:
What I think you forgot to add about posting prices on your website was that you also state that your prices are negotiable. That's an open invitation for the clients to hire based on pricing for the most part. Your over all worth is diminished when you tell them right up front "if you ask you can get me cheaper". Which is understandable when getting what you can for money is most important. Of course there are always different circumstances as not every client is the same. And as always, this is just my opinion.
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You're right, I did negelect that; however, I was very rarely asked to negotiate. That, again, is attributed to the time commitment I placed before the prospective client.

One client told me that they didn't expect to be paying so much but when I made the presentation of the time I put in on each wedding they understood and agreed with the justification.

If you simply show the prospect what they are getting for what they are paying then your chances of landing the event is higher.
 
GoodKnightDJ said:
My pricing for weddings was 20 hours of time commitment @ $50.00/hour for a base of $1,000. With add-ons that could get up to $1,500.
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Huge multi-ops aside, this is the kind of thing that makes me chuckle. So, basically we're talking about a big chunk of that time being "homework". I think it's fair to say that most of us prepare from our homes, yes?

Do you think John and Jane Doe are getting paid for the hours they spend at home preparing for work? Take a look at the post counts here each day. We should be thankful when we get something else to pass the time with.

Honestly, it's my job to prepare and be prepared to flip those speakers on for five or six hours. I certainly don't expect to be compensated for every conversation, songlist or agenda. Let's not argue commuting either. Some of my friends and family have to drive two hours plus to and from work everyday and guess what? The clock is only punched when they enter and exit the building.

I must have been doing something terribly wrong for the last 20 years, because I have never spent 20 "clockable" hours on an event.

:sqerr:
 
Request Line Productions said:
I must have been doing something terribly wrong for the last 20 years, because I have never spent 20 "clockable" hours on an event.
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You must not be as anal about details as I am. :sqwink:

If I'm working on their event then I'm on the clock. If you are not getting paid for every moment you work on an event then you need to revisit your pricing structure.

In all sincerity, my suggestion is to log every moment you spend on each event by event type. You'd be surprised at how much time you really do spend. There will be events that are less and events that are more so average them out.

I've had weddings that came out to twelve hours and others that came out to over thirty. It all depends on how much hand-holding the client requires. My average over a one year period was 20 hours and that is what I based it on.
 
Ok,

Different scenario. The phone rings @ 11:14am. It's a local swim club. The caller is frantic, asking "Can you have a DJ here by 12 noon to play a 12-3p party?

YES, TODAY!

Do you stick to your regular fee?

Do you charge an additional fee b/c of the last minute "Oh S**T factor", they neglected to think about this earlier?



This just happened to me.... unfortunately, I am unavailable, but I gave her the name/number of another DJ, who may have someone available for her.


Cheers,

Joe
 
GoodKnightDJ said:
In all sincerity, my suggestion is to log every moment you spend on each event by event type. You'd be surprised at how much time you really do spend. There will be events that are less and events that are more so average them out.
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Oh, you'll see that I never denied spending time on an event. I just don't view it as "chargeable". If I take a job, I take all that comes with it. Whether that's 20 hours or 50 hours makes no difference to me. After I find out what the client wants me to do when I walk in the door, that's what I charge them for.

You would never be able to buy a slice of pizza for a buck, if you were being charged for everything it took to get it to your mouth. :sqwink:

Just my opinion (or stupidiity). Take your pick. :rofl:
 
This is where the concept of billable hours comes in. How you define it, how you charge it, etc. Me, I just charge a flat rate and what you get is what you get. It normally comes out to about $30 an hour, which is all the market will handle in this area.

My fiance and I are getting married in Michigan where the going rate for Photogs it $1500 for 8 hours of shooting and 10 hours of editing (which comes out to about $83 an hour). How the market in Michigan bears this when the market in Texas doesn't is beyond me.

Mike
 
GoodKnightDJ said:
. Since a site visit was required for every venue, travel and time was factored in for that.
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Do you do a site visit on venues you played before? If so why?

Like Hank I don't ever recall spending 20+ hours on an event In some cases I haven't seen the Bride and Groom face to face before the event. I cant seem to justify 3 to 5 times the time planning as there is playing
 
Alphabet said:
Ok,

Different scenario. The phone rings @ 11:14am. It's a local swim club. The caller is frantic, asking "Can you have a DJ here by 12 noon to play a 12-3p party?

YES, TODAY!

Do you stick to your regular fee?
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Yes, of course. If they have the dough.

In our experience, these last-minute prospects are low-budget or have already blown their budgets and can't afford us anyhow.

As to the planning and other hours involved, cost is figured into our flat rate. It's a peace of mind thing for the client ~ they've already paid for our service.
 
Jeff Romard said:
Do you do a site visit on venues you played before? If so why?

Like Hank I don't ever recall spending 20+ hours on an event In some cases I haven't seen the Bride and Groom face to face before the event. I cant seem to justify 3 to 5 times the time planning as there is playing
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That is called inefficiency, and it get you not hired anymore in my business.

Mike
 
Esoteric said:
That is called inefficiency, and it get you not hired anymore in my business.

Mike
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Actually it's called being very efficent. I spend 1/3 the time that you do apparently and get results.

I just don't need to know the colour of the brides panties to be able to announce Mr and Mrs Jones.

Tell me the efficiency in spending 30 hours planning 4 hours of work?
 
Jeff Romard said:
Actually it's called being very efficent. I spend 1/3 the time that you do apparently and get results.

I just don't need to know the colour of the brides panties to be able to announce Mr and Mrs Jones.

Tell me the efficiency in spending 30 hours planning 4 hours of work?
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Sorry! I meant using 5 hours of planning for every hour of actual performance! That is the definition of inefficiency. To me it either points to someone who is not very good at what they do (or very inexperienced) or someone who is padding the bills.

I know a lawyer who fits 60 billable hours into a 24 hour day. Guess how?

Mike
 
Jeff Romard said:
Do you do a site visit on venues you played before? If so why?
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It depends on the venue and the manager for the day. There's one venue that's pretty consistent and I can call them and ask if it is the standard set up but most justify a site visit because they have flexible layouts and a face-to-face with the coordinator is needed.
 
Esoteric said:
That is called inefficiency, and it get you not hired anymore in my business.

Mike
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No, it is called paying attention to detail.

The 30 hour situation was with a micromanaging bride that wanted to pick every single song in the prelude for her ceremony. She had never even been to a wedding before in her life and her fiance, who had worked in a wedding factory was out of contact in military training. She called me ten times over the course of a week and each call was at least two hours long. I was saved by her fiancee when he returned; I was ready to refund her money and move on. That's why I suggested asking about wedding experience in another thread.

I probably do more hand-holding than most and that's why I probably spend more time than most. I include that factor in the pricing.
 
GoodKnightDJ said:
It depends on the venue and the manager for the day. There's one venue that's pretty consistent and I can call them and ask if it is the standard set up but most justify a site visit because they have flexible layouts and a face-to-face with the coordinator is needed.
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Thanks Tom

Mabye I am lucky I live in a small market and know all the venues for the most part, although I did get one last weekend I had never been to before. Generally the setups are always the same and if not I just work with it.

Alot of times I will play in places quite a bit out of town where it's not feasable for me to do a site visit, assuming I have never been there before, I will bring more than I need to make sure I am prepared. I learned a long time ago to never believe the hype when they tell you it's only a small place small and big are relative terms.
 
GoodKnightDJ said:
No, it is called paying attention to detail.

The 30 hour situation was with a micromanaging bride that wanted to pick every single song in the prelude for her ceremony. She had never even been to a wedding before in her life and her fiance, who had worked in a wedding factory was out of contact in military training. She called me ten times over the course of a week and each call was at least two hours long. I was saved by her fiancee when he returned; I was ready to refund her money and move on. That's why I suggested asking about wedding experience in another thread.

I probably do more hand-holding than most and that's why I probably spend more time than most. I include that factor in the pricing.
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So I should pay more because you like to be more involved? Why couldn't I just pay hourly?

Mike
 
Esoteric said:
So I should pay more because you like to be more involved? Why couldn't I just pay hourly?

Mike
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You don't have to pay me at all, you can keep looking.

Each prospect was presented with a time commitment that showed a breakdown of what they were getting for their money and how much time was dedicated to these items. The minimum, maximum, and average times were shown. if i still have it, I'll post it but it may already be in one of my threads.

As I said, when they saw the time commitment then they saw the justification for the price.
 
GoodKnightDJ said:
You don't have to pay me at all, you can keep looking.
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Interesting.... So you make all your clients pay for your inefficiency and for the neurotic clients that might take up more time? I need to become a DJ. Or at least adopt your pricing policy. *lol*

Mike
 
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