Well the Knot refused my counter offer
- Thread starter Ron
- Start date
I'm really curious on analytics. TK shows a fairly healthy clip of web traffic for this first month; 53 unique visitors, 27 engagements and 22 click-thrus. Google analytics and Squarespace analytics shows zero coming from TK. I got one (legit) lead from them this first partial-month of advertising. Right now, I have 22 reviews. I think (hope) my page and samples are at least decent, at least in line with the competition. Here's my TK page. Would be glad to hear anyone's thoughts in regards. Does it really suck and I'm just missing it?
Ryan Wedding Photography
Rick I've said this before your Knot site looks great....But so do the other 1069 that are there...as a matter of fact they all look the same. I looked at about a dozen and trying to think from a clients perspective I don't see anything outstanding on any of them. If I was a client looking to book I would go strictly on price by looking at the sites there. You are paying $1600 to be just like everyone else but you are in the 18th spot on the list
Your pics are top notch in my opinion and your reviews are great but what on the site sets you apart from the others?
Here is some of your competition randomly picked at different price points. Their pics are no better, they all have great reviews, and they all offer what you do except they are ahead of you in the listings. The Knot format doesn't allow for anyone to stand out that has always been my issue with them and Wedding Wire
Openview Weddings
Christy Wilson Photography
George Street Photo & Video
Nashville Photography Group
To me, and this is just an opinion, there are much better outlets to plunk $1600 down
Your pics are top notch in my opinion and your reviews are great but what on the site sets you apart from the others?
Here is some of your competition randomly picked at different price points. Their pics are no better, they all have great reviews, and they all offer what you do except they are ahead of you in the listings. The Knot format doesn't allow for anyone to stand out that has always been my issue with them and Wedding Wire
Openview Weddings
Christy Wilson Photography
George Street Photo & Video
Nashville Photography Group
To me, and this is just an opinion, there are much better outlets to plunk $1600 down
Thanks for the comments, Jeff and the kudos. I kinda figured TK was a numbers game. They reserve the top 6 slots for their highest-paying clients, then the rest of us in the middle get randomly displayed. Sometimes I'm on line #4, sometimes line #10. My thought on it is that I likely will land at least 4-5 jobs. Magic's posts basically convinced me that I didn't have a strong enough portfolio last year. I think I have a sufficient (as good as anyone else) portfolio, and hopefully the sales pitch is better crafted, so now it's just comes down to rolling the dice. I decided to pay the full year for two reasons; I get a month free and, I don't have to think about money going out every month (buy once, cry once). I'm trying to take a longer view on my marketing dollars. The only thing at present is the danged analytics and why TK is showing something completely different from google or SS. As much as I've poo-pooed them, I'm actually thinking of taking out a base-level WW slot. It'll run me about $700/year. Again, if it just produces a few gigs, I'm golden.
It always makes sense to pay for the year at a discount if you can for sure. The good part is that it doesn't require a lot of jobs to get your money back. What would it cost to be in the top 3 I really believe that might be the best way to use the Knot if that's what you use
As for the analytics what do they consider unique visitors, engagements and click-thrus? They may only calculate their site and if that's the case a lot of the visitors may have been spiders
It's another $1200-$1500 to upgrade to the top-tier. I agree, it would be better at the top but I considered this a gamble. I figured if I could pickup a couple of jobs by Jan-Feb, then it would likely make sense to bump up. I want to see some kind of results before I fork over more money. As for the analytics, no clue. A lot of those clicks have been from me. I had a couple of scam leads and one valid, but she was a budget bride.
the knot rotates the order of those on the page - so now you're 3rd and the next view you're 10th then the next you're 5th. The higher paid listings are first, then the second then the freebies.
Like anything on the net, if you're not on the first page might as well not exist.
Like anything on the net, if you're not on the first page might as well not exist.
I know I'm not good at math...
but doesn't this make the "higher" tier $1200 a year....compared to $1600 for a "featured" vendor?
Or did you mean the HIGHER tier was $100 MORE a month?
$1600 is for the basic "featured vendor". You have to add another $1200 ($2800/year) to buy one of the top 6 slots on the page. I want to prove out whether TK will payoff at $1600 first. If they do, I'll gladly pay another $1200 to get top of page placement.
I paid $4,255 for google adwords last year. I went overboard with it, and let the ads run for too long. Anyway, I booked about $8,500 in gigs out of it. If a Knot ad at $1,600 yields more than $5,000 or so in gigs for the year then I would say it's better ROI than google adwords.
Are those photo's yours? While they are technically correct they are all quite cold and obviously staged which robs them of any emotion. I don't think anyone was actually smiling. To connect with people you have to show real people in real moments. Every woman lives in a world where they are confronted with unreal magazine covers - if your work copies that form then you subconsciously appear to suffer from the same lack of authenticity. If you go out of your way to copy the look of magazine covers and catalogs it will usually work against you with brides.
As for analytics, are you poisoning your own data? I just became a unique visitor (as did everyone else in this thread) and you have no chance of booking me. Also, mine is a dynamic IP and if your own is as well - then each day you check your own page you are adding a unique visitor.
It's interesting that you say that. I consider the lower level listings on these sites more of a gamble than the higher end ones. At $700... you can recoup the investment quicker, but the chances of quality leads are low. At $2000 a year... yes you have a hole to climb out of... but you're guaranteed a LOT more exposure.
I waited for WeddingWire to open a Featured Ad, because I wasn't willing to unload $1100 for a gamble position. Instead, I paid $3,500 for front page placement.
That being said it has certainly paid for itself... but not necessarily at a level that I'm committed to continuing. If I booked 2 more before my term is up, it's probably worth continuing with.
Just got my 2nd (legit) lead from TheKnot. Bride wants to know if we're comfortable, shooting pictures of her blind husband? I have to admit, that's a new one......
The one thing I just noticed about The Knot is that they label each vendor under their picture by how their pricing is structured.
They rate DJs as
1. "Inexpensive "
2. "Affordable"
3. "Moderate"
I don't see any DJs rated as higher than "moderate" ...maybe because no DJs on their have set their bottom price way high, OR the Knot doesn't want to label any vendors as "Expensive" lol
I noticed that the vendors labeled as "affordable" seem to typically have more reviews than "Inexpensive" or "Moderate" labeled DJs...but that also be due to their tenure advertising with TK as well.
They rate DJs as
1. "Inexpensive "
2. "Affordable"
3. "Moderate"
I don't see any DJs rated as higher than "moderate" ...maybe because no DJs on their have set their bottom price way high, OR the Knot doesn't want to label any vendors as "Expensive" lol
I noticed that the vendors labeled as "affordable" seem to typically have more reviews than "Inexpensive" or "Moderate" labeled DJs...but that also be due to their tenure advertising with TK as well.
One thing I dispise seeing is when DJs advertise themselves as "CHEAP". That's a bad word unless you are the local Ollie's Bulk purchasing discount outlet.
The next stop above that which is not saying much is advertising the word "Affordable". Advertising your service as affordable just comes off as negative to me. "Hey I'm affordable!" ....Well, what does affordable really mean? And affordable to whom? To some people a Chevrolet Corvette is affordable, yet to others, a new Kia might seem too expensive! There are people out there who view Ferraris as "affordable".
I think The Knot is definitely categorizing their services on price. ...Also if you are labeled "inexpensive"...you better be on the low tier of pricing compared to the other DJs for sure when brides come knocking on your door looking for a quote. If they think your price is mid level, or more than "inexpensive" they won't be happy about it.
The next stop above that which is not saying much is advertising the word "Affordable". Advertising your service as affordable just comes off as negative to me. "Hey I'm affordable!" ....Well, what does affordable really mean? And affordable to whom? To some people a Chevrolet Corvette is affordable, yet to others, a new Kia might seem too expensive! There are people out there who view Ferraris as "affordable".
I think The Knot is definitely categorizing their services on price. ...Also if you are labeled "inexpensive"...you better be on the low tier of pricing compared to the other DJs for sure when brides come knocking on your door looking for a quote. If they think your price is mid level, or more than "inexpensive" they won't be happy about it.
DJs get to rate themselves on pricing. The Knot isn't setting that price.
Prices are all relative, but we get to judge what relative is.
ahh...Explains why nobody picked "Expensive" LOL.
"Of course we are not expensive...We are a great value for what we charge says I!"
So a DJ who quotes $2.500, and a DJ who quotes $650 could all have the "Moderate" label" ...While at the same time, a DJ who quotes like $695 could have the "Inexpensive" label on the Knot. Not that helpful to the consumer if that happens to be the case when they get price quotes.